EnglishLesson2023-04-30-1
B: Sightseeing?
A: Yeah, sightseeing. Do you have any recommendations in Osaka?
B: It's a difficult question. The local food is good for visitors.
A: What kind of food?
B: I just came up with takoyaki. Do you know takoyaki?
A: Ah, yeah. The kind of dumplings.
B: Yes, but it contains octopus. I'm not sure if octopus is familiar to Westerners.
A: Right.
A: So you live in Tokyo now?
B: Yes, about 20 years.
A: 20 years? So you're kind of settled in Tokyo.
B: Yes.
A: Nice. Do you like it?
B: Yes.
A: Good. Where do you live?
B: Do you know X? It's on the west part of Tokyo. It's on the Y line.
A: Yes, I see. Good access.
B: Yes, yes.
A: Why did you choose X?
B: Actually, to tell the truth, I didn't choose. My wife chose.
A: Your wife chose? Okay.
B: Yes, my wife chose. The reason why we settled in Tokyo is also the main reason is my wife. She likes Tokyo very much. She comes from Hokkaido. So compared to Hokkaido, Tokyo has a lot of shops, museums, and theaters. She likes those kinds of things.
A: That's understandable. How about you?
B: I have no strong opinion. I suggested moving to a more rural area, but she strongly opposed.
A: You give up?
B: Yeah, I give up. She's in charge of most of our food, cooking and buying vegetables, so I can't disagree with her. She said there are a lot of opportunities important for the quality of life. So I just say, "Oh, I see." I don't want to fight over this.
A: Yes, I agree with you. It's impossible to win. You want the easy life.
B: Yeah, yeah.
A: And what's your hobby?
B: I like playing games, but recently I don't have much time to play games. I'm too busy learning English.
A: Because in the middle of next month you have a plan with Taiwanese people visiting, right?
B: Yes, I need to speak English with them. To tell the truth, I haven't used English since college, about eight years.
A: So your English is rusty. Rusty means out of practice. So you need to practice English conversation intensively. What's your weak point according to the test?
B: Though my vocabulary and knowledge of English words are very high, my speaking and listening are weak. So I need to practice conversation in real-life situations.
A: And why are the Taiwanese coming to Japan?
B: Recently, they and I are interested in the same topics. It's about digital technology to make democracy better. This is a topic of our shared interest.
A: I see. In Japan, you still use the paper ballot system, right?
B: Yes, it's costly, so we cannot use it frequently. People can't express their opinions to the government so frequently. I think the communication between the people and the government is weak in Japan.
A: So you think if they could use an electronic ballot, they could communicate more smoothly?
B: Yes, for specific topics, not just for elections like choosing a mayor. For example, whether we should abolish a local building or not. For example, there is...
A: Jingu Stadium.
B: Yes, yeah. Recently, in my hometown, there's a place for children to visit after school. Some people say we should abolish the facility to make it more effective.
A: Demolish means knock down. Abolish means get rid of completely. Which one do you mean?
D: I mean, I should say upgrade it for another purpose. They want to upgrate it to elderly.
A: I see. So you're talking about renovating the building for another purpose.
B: Yes, renovate and repurpose the building. Many opinions on that. I mean it is controversial issue.
B: If people can easily express their opinion on each issue, the government becomes much better, I think.
A: Right. That's very interesting. So kind of like a poll, P-O-L-L.
B: Yes, like a poll. But usually, with a poll, the issues are made by the government, and then people express their opinions on them. We need to express the issue for the poll.
A: So we need to choose the issue.
B: It is a good way to express opinions.
A: That's right. And is this the way it's done in Taiwan?
B: Yes, the Taiwanese people do it. For example, when Uber entered Taiwan, there was a controversial issue. The Taiwanese government made a system vTaiwan for that kind of thing, and the people of Taiwan discussed on a kind of forums and used a kind of polls. The system visualized the opinion distribution, and finally, the Ministry of Digital Affairs decided which opinion was more acceptable.
A: So they decide the best course of action. And I guess that can be customized to the particular area too. Maybe like in Tokyo it may not be good, but Yokohama is okay, or something like that.
B: Maybe some cities in Japan can choose a similar mechanism to make public agreement.
A: Yeah, consensus. So it's like a digital democracy.
B: Right, a digital democracy. The Taiwanese people are going ahead, and Japan is lagging behind. We should learn from Taiwan a lot of things.
B: Yes, we need to catch up with them.
A: And I've never been to Taiwan. Have you?
B: Yes, but when I was a student.
A: I see. And what is Taiwan like? Is it a good country?
B: It is a good country. People are friendly.
A: How about law and order?
B: I've just visited for a short time, about a week. So I'm not sure.
A: "I couldn't really tell."
B: I don't know much about.
A: No, it's done deeply.
A: Do you have any requests for the lesson? Anything you want to do?
B: Do you have any questions about this discussion? Because it is a very real situation.
A: Great, great, yeah. No, I do have lots of questions. So this system goes directly to the government ministry, you mean?
B: Ministry? Ah, I know the word ministry, but I couldn't catch the meaning of your question.
A: The poll results, questions or whatever, go directly there?
B: Yes, but I think the bigger system moves slowly. So we couldn't change the ministry directly. We should focus on a smaller community, such as a city or district.
A: Kind of like a local town, right. I see, I see.
A: And what happens if the local official just ignores that?
B: There are many local governments; some are positive about introducing new technology, and some are not. So we focus on the more progressive governments and make a report so that Japanese people know what other people are doing.
A: And then you can give them examples. So you can say "point in case." And if they are reluctant to do that, do you have some kind of education or training to explain the benefits of this system to the maybe a little bit reluctant people?
B: Ah, because we don't have much power, so at first, we focus on early adopters. I agree, most of the people, the majority is reluctant.
A: So what you hope to do is to find some enthusiastic local places and then maybe collaborate with them and use them as a showcase to persuade other areas to do it.
B: Yes.
A: And how do you make money?
B: Actually, this project is not my main work. My job is a researcher at a software company. So this is a side project, completely voluntary, no money.
A: So you are a volunteer?
B: Yes, but it is interesting for me. I am enthusiastic about the project.
A: And why are you so enthusiastic? Many young people in Japan seem not interested in politics or local issues, or maybe they are a little bit apathetic or disillusioned.
B: I think there is a lot of variety. Some young people are very enthusiastic about politics. For example, there is a 26-year-old mayor in Ashiya city. Some local communities are very positive about young power, especially those familiar with digital technology.
A: So do you think that this digital transformation will make Japanese young people more enthusiastic or less apathetic about politics and hope that they can change the situation?
B: I think so. Because in the paper ballot system, the communication between the people and the government is very weak.
A: Oh, but ballot is election, right?
B: Yes. I think it is weak communication. And by digital technology we cah get much broader communication between the people and the government.
A: Okay.
B: From the viewpoint of the government, the government can observe the people's thought, idea, feeling much better, much easier. I think it is good for the government itself. And from the viewpoint of the people, they can express their idea easily and express it to government.
A: So you're saying, you're arguing that it gives the people a bigger voice.
B: Yeah, and the main reason of the problem is disillusionment. Many people think they can't change the government. They can't change how the government operates. They can't change the policy of government. Many people think that. But it can change with digital technology.
A: And where does, how about accountability? I mean, okay, so let's say a lot of people send their opinion to the ministry.
B: The final decision is made by the minister. We just give them much information to decide the policy.
A: So keep their finger on the pulse. Citizens sentiment.
B: Sentiment is nice word to express it.
A: So we say keep the finger on the pulse so they can hear or evaluate how the people are feeling or what they want or their desires or maybe the things that they are worried about, concerns.
B: Right. And it is a rapid feedback. It is important because if government make a decision and the feedback is an election one year later, it is very slow feedback.
A: Okay.
B: It's not good for feedback in the decision.
A: It's a very slow process.
B: Yes, slow process.
A: So my next question would be, do you think that this kind of system could increase the rise of populism?
Populism? Populism is like when the politicians set their manifesto purely to gain votes. For example, like Trump is a good example in the last election. So he set up some policies that his manifesto and maybe he was purely hoping to get votes. So if the politicians know the feelings of the people exactly, well they can kind of manipulate the manifesto to get what they want. Do you know what I mean?
B: Yes, I understand your question. It is a difficult question. I don't have the answer right now, but it's a good point to consider.
A: What are the negatives to the system in your opinion?
B: I agree with your concern that it may bring populism, but on the other hand, many Japanese people are not interested in politics. I think this is because Japanese politicians don't pay much attention to voters since the feedback process is weak. It is just my opinion. There is no data for that.
A: So let's say a politician wanted to make his position stronger. He checks the data coming in and finds out that most people in Japan want a big issue to be resolved. He puts that in his manifesto and then calls a snap election. And then gets huge support and then gets control of maybe the upper house and lower house, etc. What do you think about that?
B: It could happen.
A: I guess it depends on how the technology is used, whether it's used for positive things or to manipulate.
B : I have another suggestion. Currently the governing party is very strong and the opposition party is very weak. And recently the opposition party is doing a populism and it is not successful. They get a small amount of support against the government and the other majority vote to the governing party and the governing party becomes much stronger.
A: Even stronger?
B: Even stronger. It is the case which happens currently in Japan, I think.
A: Give me an example of an issue where the opposition have tried to gain populist support in Japan.
B: For example, some populists say we should abolish the consumption tax. Some people support them, but others think they're just saying that to get votes and don't explain how they would make up for the shortfall in tax revenue.
A: It is not really realistic. It's just empty talk. Just for getting votes. Or we say electioneering talk. So we want to abolish the tax. But most Japanese didn't fall for it. They didn't go for it. Okay, fair enough. They're smart.
B: Thank you.
A: So we're almost out of time, let's wrap up, okay?
B: Yeah, that was very good.
A: So, takoyaki dumplings contains octopus. My wife chose it. She comes from Hokkaido. I don't mind. Easy life is best. I'm busy learning English. My English is rusty, I'm out of practice. We need to oil the rust. I'm studying English intensively. According to the test, my weak point is ABC. In real life situations, it's costly. Demolish means break down. Get rid of completely. Renovate means to change the form. Repurpose the building. Controversial. Express your opinion on. Consensus. Lagging behind. We need to catch up.
A: Bigger voice, accountability. Keep your finger on the pulse of the sentiment of the people. Populism, pros and cons. On the other hand, it could happen. There's a chance it could happen. It's possible. The opposition party, the governing party, the majority, minority. Progressives, reluctant. Enthusiastic. The project, apathetic, disillusionment. A 26-year-old mayor in collaboration with the ministry. Thank you.